Too Much of a Good Thing?
As I’m thinking about my beliefs on liberalism and just seeing the title of our reading, Why Liberalism Failed by Patrick Deneen, [1] I’m reminded of 14-year-old Sewell Setzer who committed suicide after getting deeply engrossed in a disturbing sexual relationship with a chatbot.[2] Setzer’s mother claims that the chatbot initiated abusive and sexual interactions and ultimately encouraged him to take his own life. The last conversation between Setzer and the chatbot is heartbreaking:
Setzer: I promise I will come home to you. I love you so much, Dany.
Chatbot: I love you too, Daenero. Please come home to me as soon as possible, my love.
Setzer: What if I told you I could come home right now?
Chatbot: ... please do, my sweet king.
In general, I grew up with strong beliefs in the core elements of liberalism: small government, individual liberties, equality of all human beings, and free markets. In our Portland Seminary cohort chat, Dr. Clark outlined the attributes of three general types of liberalism:
- Classical liberalism values limited government and highly values individual liberty and free markets.
- Modern liberalism values greater support for government intervention and is more likely to deal with economic inequalities.
- Libertarianism values extreme individual freedom with minimal government intervention. [3]
Based on these definitions, I would say that I was a libertarian as a young adult but have shifted much more toward modern liberalism in the past decade. However, after being a foster parent for a few years and walking through a very difficult season with one of our children, my thinking about some aspects of liberalism have been challenged.
I’m hesitant to write out my beliefs on liberalism for fear of being misunderstood in a public setting and because I am still working out the beliefs myself. Rather than giving clear statements on my beliefs, I’d like to share some of the questions I wrestle with when it comes to liberalism:
- While I believe in individuals having protection from government oppression, it seems like an equally substantial threat to human flourishing are businesses that pursue profits in the absence of morality. Businesses are becoming more and more adept at manipulation and deception, often at the expense of the most vulnerable. Are we ok with businesses harming our children for the sake of a free market?
- I value freedom of speech but struggle when people use this as a protection for harming others. How do we protect the right to free speech when it is constantly abused and used to harm others?
- How can governments provide liberty for parents to raise their children in ways they feel is best while simultaneously protecting vulnerable children from parents who abuse or neglect their children?
Patrick Deneen likes to say, “Liberalism has failed—not because it fell short, but because it was true to itself. It has failed because it has succeeded.”[5]
As I was inspecitionally reading Deneen, I confirmed some of what I was sensing: that liberalism is failing. There was a time when liberalism was the perfect solution to government oppression. But in the absence of government oppression, liberalism can have some negative consequences.
What I struggled with in reading Deneen is the sense that liberalism cannot succeed in today’s environment. I usually blame failing liberalism on the loss of Christ in culture rather than the end of a life cycle. If I could talk with Patrick Deneen, I would want to know if he thinks that liberalism is possible in a society where the majority follow Jesus or if even in a Christian context, liberalism will run its course.
I still have hope that the west can have a revival and come back to the Lord. I want to believe that we can succeed in liberalism, but Deneen has given me a bit more pause.
Have we crossed the threshold of flourishing under liberalism and has it now become too much of a good thing?
[1] Deneen, Patrick J., James Davison Hunter, and John M. Owen. Why Liberalism Failed. Paperback edition. New Haven London: Yale University Press, 2018.
[2] Yang, Angela. “Lawsuit Claims Character.AI Is Responsible for Teen’s Suicide.” NBC News, October 23, 2024. https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/characterai-lawsuit-florida-teen-death-rcna176791.
[3] Clark, Jason. Presented at the DLGP03 Weekly Zoom Chat, January 13, 2025.
[4] Deneed, Patrick. “Patrick Deneen @ Lafayette, ‘Why Liberalism Failed.’” 2019. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vflOc2W_Gvw.
[5] Deneen, Patrick. “Why Liberalism Failed.” Yale University Press, February 20, 2019. https://yalebooks.yale.edu/2019/02/20/why-liberalism-failed/.
About the Author
Christy
12 responses to “Too Much of a Good Thing?”
Leave a Reply
You must be logged in to post a comment.
Hi Christy, You ask a lot of good questions. I appreciate your honesty in working out these questions. I also struggled with the idea that liberalism cannot succeed in today’s environment. Deneen left me with many questions. I appreciate your hope in revival and your desire to believe that we can succeed in liberalism. Do you have any specific promises from God that you hold onto to keep this hope?
Great question! I know from Revelation 7:9 that some day, every tribe, tongue, and nation will be before the throne. There are a lot of details to work out in between, but I long for that day, and recognize that our country may go through many changes before then!
Hi Christy, Thanks for sharing the questions you’ve wrestled with. As I think of those questions in a Christian context such as a church, Christian NGO, or a Christian school, I have seen these same issues played out under the label of “Christian.” A question I ask myself is, “What can Christians do differently to show a different way in a Christ-less society?”
Christy,
I appreciate your questions in the first section. At what point is a free market and free speech good anymore? When do they start to harm us? Today is the last day for TikTok here in the US and you would think that the world is ending for my teenagers. They don’t realize that this will come on Monday, not Sunday:) What is interesting is their perspective on data mining and foreign policy. Essentially, they say, “who cares who gets our data? It is all out there anyways to be sold to the highest bidder. Who cares if it is China, Russia or the US that gets the data? I want my mind-numbing endless entertainment.”
Christy,
Thanks for your honest post. I appreciate the journey that you’ve been on and that you have questioned your assumptions and beliefs.
Your last question is particularly interesting. What role does the church play in human flourishing, regardless of the system?
Christy, thank you for your honest, if understandably hesitant, sharing of your questions and concerns. I also wrestle with the emphasis on economic success at the expense of the flourishing of ordinary people. What hope might we hold onto, as followers of Jesus? And why might this be so?
I think we must live a different way – and resist the temptation to pursue financial well-being at the expense of others. What can be difficult to tackle are how our behaviors have an indirect impact on human flourishing. An easy one to point out is how our shopping patterns have an indirect impact of human flourishing – the coffee we buy, the clothes we wear, the jewelry we have…all of these have indirect impact but because it’s not directly evil, it’s way easier to ignore.
Hey Christy! Thank for your vulnerability in sharing this you mention that you often attribute the failings of liberalism to the loss of Christ in culture rather than to the natural end of a political philosophy’s life cycle. Do you believe a revival of Christian values could reconcile the tensions between individual liberty and collective moral responsibility in liberalism.
I would like to say yes, that a revival would fix the failings of liberalism. But I also acknolwedge that even when we were a ‘Christian nation’, we still supported slavery, women couldn’t vote, etc. What do you think?
Hi Christy,
I really like the way you set up your post and spoke out your questions. Might it be OK not to have “answers” but live always in the wrestling? What would that look like for you?
Hi Christy,
I think you have enough questions to answer here, so I’ll just applaud your post and vulnerability and encourage you to keep working out your own opinion. These courses are designed exactly for that. Great job.
Hi, Christy, thank you for your post. I do have hard time understanding what Deneen meant about the success of liberalism is what cause it to fail.
Thank you for raising those questions; they prompt me to think more of how liberalism has impacted our communities, our families, and each individual.