The Power of Interdependence in Leadership: Lessons from Schein, Schein and Tutu
In a world that often celebrates individualism and self-made success, Humble Leadership by Edgar H. Schein and Peter A. Schein offers a refreshing and necessary counter-narrative. The authors argue that the future of effective leadership lies not in authority or charisma, but in relationships, openness, and trust—the building blocks of interdependence. This concept is not just theoretical; it’s embodied in the life and leadership of Archbishop Desmond Tutu, whose legacy offers a profound example of what interdependent leadership looks like in action.
At the heart of Humble Leadership is the idea that leadership is a collaborative process, not a solo performance. This is the powerful idea I want to explore. The Scheins emphasize that leaders must move beyond transactional interactions and cultivate Level 2 relationships—those built on mutual respect, vulnerability, and shared purpose [1]. This kind of leadership requires humility, the courage to listen, and the willingness to be changed by others. It’s not about having all the answers, but about creating space where collective wisdom can emerge.
Bishop Desmond Tutu exemplified this beautifully. His leadership during South Africa’s Truth and Reconciliation Commission was not marked by dominance, but by deep empathy and relational trust. He understood that healing a nation required more than political solutions—it required a moral and emotional renegotiation that was not dependent upon one person, but through shared dialogue and mutual accountability. This is how he could even see himself removed from the equation with little consequence.
God’s purposes are certain. They may remove a Tutu, they may remove the South African Council of Churches, but God’s intention to establish his Kingdom of justice, of love, of compassion, will not be thwarted. We are not scared, certainly not of the government, or any other perpetrators of injustice and oppression, for victory is ours through him who loved us [2].
Tutu’s approach was deeply interdependent: he leaned on the stories of victims and perpetrators alike, trusting that truth-telling in community could lead to transformation.
Why This Matters for Emerging Generations
As Generation Z and Alpha begin to emerge in leadership roles, the value of interdependence becomes even more critical. These generations are growing up in a hyperconnected world, shaped by collaboration, diversity, and digital fluency. They are less impressed by hierarchy and more drawn to authenticity, inclusion, and shared purpose.
Interdependent leadership resonates with their values. It empowers them to lead with others, not over others—to build trust, foster belonging, and co-create solutions. In a time marked by global challenges and rapid change, no leader can succeed alone. Gen Z and Alpha need models of leadership that prioritize community over competition, and dialogue over dominance. This is what Karise Hutchinson refers to as the power of influence. “Real power is empowering others, building trust, and carrying it with humility” [3]. The power of such leadership is in the generous posture of a leader who see and value the contributions of those in the room, call them forth, and inspire collective thought and action.
Moreover, these generations are deeply attuned to issues of justice, identity, and mental health. Interdependent leadership offers a framework that supports emotional intelligence, empathy, and resilience—qualities essential for navigating complexity and leading with integrity.
By embracing the principles of Humble Leadership and learning from exemplars like Desmond Tutu, Gen Z and Gen Alpha can shape a future where leadership is not about power, but about collaborative interdependence. It’s a future built on trust, openness, and the courage to lead together.
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[1] The Steins offer four levels of leadership, with the sentiments they produce. Level Minus 1 is Oppressive Leadership, which produces a sentiment of antipathy, Level 1 is Transactional Leadership, which produces apathy. Level 2 is Collaborative Leadership, which produces empathy, and Level 3 is Bonded Relationships, which produces compassion. Edgar H. Schein and Peter A. Schein, Humble Leadership: The Powers of Relationships, Openness, and Trust, First edition, Oakland, CA: Berrett-Koehler Publishers, 2018, 29-30.
[2] Tutu and Allen 1994, 78, in Birgit Herppich, DESMOND MPILO TUTU (1931 – ) A LIFE FOR GOD’S DREAM, Writing Project, Fuller School of Intercultural Studies, 2006, 35.
[3] Karise Hutchinson, “The Power of Influence: Light and shadow, Humility, Trust, Light and shadow”, in Illuminaire: Bringing Life & Light to Leaders across the World, Northern Ireland, Illuminaire Press, 2023, 15.
About the Author
Joel Zantingh
Joel Zantingh is a catalyst for peacemaking and intercultural teams, speaker, theologian and consultant. He is the Canadian Coordinator of the World Evangelical Alliance's Peace and Reconciliation Network, and the Director of Engagement with Lausanne Movement Canada. He has served in local and national roles within the Evangelical Missionary Church of Canada, and led their global mission arm. He has experience teaching in formal and informal settings with Bible college students and leaders from various cultures and generations. Joel and Christie are parents to adult children, as well as grandparents. They reside in Guelph, Ont., situated on the treaty lands and territory of the Mississaugas of the Credit, and home to many past, present and future First Nations peoples, including the Anishinnabe and Hodinöhsö:ni'.8 responses to “The Power of Interdependence in Leadership: Lessons from Schein, Schein and Tutu”
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Hey Joel,
I really appreciated the way you brought Generations Z and Alpha into the conversation. I’ve been overseas long enough that I didn’t even realize Alpha was an official category—I’m starting to think you’re my go-to for keeping me updated on emerging terms! (I didn’t even know what BIPOC was until I met you.)
Your reflections on Gen Z and Alpha and their sensitivity to issues of justice, identity, and mental health immediately brought Jonathan Haidt’s “The Anxious Generation” to mind and the challenges these groups are navigating. In your international work, with your finger so closely on the pulse, do you find this heightened attunement to be a universal reality across contexts, or does it lean more Western? I’m asking because some of my friends in North Africa—who fall into the Gen Z category—are always talking about the need for change, but often with little movement toward practical application.
Thanks for this question, Elysse. I sympathize with many younger leaders in Africa and other regions which experience a greater “power distance” culturally between leaders and the wider population. For them, the Level 2 feels foreign. However, what I have learned from Indigenous practice in Canada and other parts of the world is that decision-making structures value the voice of everyone. I would surmise that younger (Gen Z) leaders across cultures are pushing back on the hierarchical constructs that do not practice shared dialogue and mutual discernment. And in order to move there, the way is not only “forward” to new ideas, but also “back” to the lost indigenous practices. Organizations like Global Unites, Lausanne YLGen (Younger Leaders Gen / Gathering), and key younger advocates like Sinéad Bovell work hard to build in more diverse thinking in the way they envision societal impact.
How this will impact the majority world will be interesting to listen in on.
Hey Joel! I really appreciate how you fused together the generational divide in your post. Picking up on your last statement, can you share what a practical application looks like that leads to impact?
Hi Joel, when I was reading this book, I actually thought of something you said in a previous semester, paraphrased as wondering if all the voices were at the table and able to be heard. Your ministry seems to be geared toward giving people a voice. I do think that is a first step of sharing power and ultimately having a productive outcome. Are you finding that the more you are able to bring in diverse voices that you actually do find those ah ha moments? PS -missed you in class on Monday.l
Diane. I missed being there on Monday, too! I was on a flight, somewhere over the North Atlantic. I work in 2 movements that do a lot of “convening”. I love how you are connecting a leader’s courageous capacity to listen and willingness to be changed by others is tied in to this concept of asking whose voice is missing from the table? The more that humble leaders can take the time to convene across generations, ethnicities, and roles, the richer the outcome of interdependence.
I’m curious whether you see this as too altruistic, or only achievable if there’s a long on-ramp or timeline. How would it work in your world?
I would hope it isn’t too altruistic. In my world, it could mean being more intentional about bringing the people we serve to the table, rather than assuming that since they might not have the cognitive ability to process complex concepts that they shouldn’t be heard. This movement is happening across our sector but it is slower than I would like.
Hi Joel, Thank you for the lovely and inspiring post. It has been years of effort and education for me to shed my old autocratic leadership past. What are your thoughts on how I can help others with similar backstories move forward more quickly?
Julie. I don’t think theres a fast track. I think the modelling and story-telling will inspire. Next generations will join in leading onward.
I asked you about how this applies to your NPO (on your blog post). I look forward to continuing the conversation there.